Austin Miller's Warren Commission Testimony (back to the list of witnesses)

(Miller was standing on the triple overpass)

Mr. BELIN - Well, describe what happened. Did you see the motorcade come by?
Mr. MILLER - Yes sir; it came down main street and turned north on Houston Street and went over two blocks and turned left on Elm Street. Got about halfway down the hill going toward the underpass and that is when as I recall the first shot was fired.
Mr. BELIN - Did you know it was a shot when you heard it?
Mr. MILLER - I didn't know it. I thought at first the motorcycle backfiring or somebody throwed some firecrackers out.
Mr. BELIN - Then what did you hear or see?
Mr. MILLER - After the first one, just a few seconds later, there was two more shots fired, or sounded like a sound at the time. I don't know for sure. And it was after that I saw some man in the car fall forward, and a women next to him grab him and hollered, and just what, I don't know exactly what she said.
Mr. BELIN - Then what did you see?
Mr. MILLER - About that time I turned to look toward the - there is a little plaza sitting on the hill. I looked over there to see if anything was there, who through the firecracker or whatever it was, or see if anything was up there, and there wasn't nobody standing there, so I stepped back and looked at the tracks to see if anybody run across the railroad tracks, and there was nobody running across the railroad tracks. So I turned right straight back just in time to see the convertible take off fast.
Mr. BELIN - You mean the convertible in which the President was riding?
Mr. MILLER - I wouldn't want to say it was the President. It was a convertible, but I saw a man fall over. I don't know whose convertible it was.
Mr. BELIN - Where did the shots sound like they came from?
Mr. MILLER - Well, the way it sounded like, it came from the, I would say from right there in the car. Would be to my left, the way I was looking at him toward that incline.
Mr. BELIN - Is there anything else that you can think of that you saw?
Mr. MILLER - About the time I looked over to the side there, there was a police officer. No; a motorcycle running his motor under against the curb, and jumped off and come up to the hill toward the top and right behind him was some more officers and plainclothesmen, too.
Mr. BELIN - Did you see anyone that might be, that gave any suspicious movements of any kind over there?
Mr. MILLER - No, sir; I didn't
Mr. BELIN - Did you see anyone when you looked around on the railroad tracks, that you hadn't seen before
Mr. MILLER - No, sir; I didn't.

Posner & Harris - Miller's testimony lacks enough detail to support or contradict either theory.

Royce Skelton's Warren Commission Testimony (back to the list of witnesses)

(Skelton was standing on the triple overpass)

Mr. BALL - Did you see the President's car turn on Elm Street?
Mr. SKELTON - Yes, sir; I saw the car carrying the Presidential flag turn.
Mr. BALL - And did you hear something soon after that?
Mr. SKELTON - Just about the same time the car straightened up - got around the corner - I heard two shots, but I didn't know at the time they were shots.
Mr. BALL - Where did they seem to come from?
Mr. SKELTON - Well, I couldn't tell then, they were still to far from where I was.
Mr. BALL - Did the shots sound like they came from where you were standing?
Mr. SKELTON - No, sir; definitely not. It sounded like they were right there - more or less like motorcycle backfire, but I thought that they were these dumb balls that they throw at the cement because I could see the smoke coming up off the cement.
Mr. BALL - You saw smoke come off the cement?
Mr. SKELTON - Yes.
Mr. BALL - Where did it seem to you that the sound came from, what direction?
Mr. SKELTON - Towards the President's car.
Mr. BALL - From the President's car.
Mr. SKELTON - right around the motorcycles and all that - I couldn't distinguish because it was too far away.
Mr. BALL - How long did you stand there?
Mr. SKELTON - I stood there from about 12:15 until the time the President was shot.
Mr. BALL - How many shots did you hear?
Mr. SKELTON - I think I heard four - I mean - I couldn't be sure.
Mr. BALL - You think you heard four?
Mr. SKELTON - Yes.

(later testimony)

Mr. SKELTON - About when I saw one of the bullets where it hit on the pavement and it hit, the smoke did come from the general vicinity of where you say Oswald was.
Mr. BALL - Wait a minute - let me ask you some questions about that. Tell me, now, about the smoke - did you see some smoke?
Mr. SKELTON - After those two shots, and the car came on down closer to the triple underpass, well there was another shot - two more shots I heard, but one of them - I saw a bullet, or I guess it was a bullet - I take for granted it was - hit the left front of the President's car on the cement, and when it did, the smoke carried with it - away from the building.
Mr. BALL - You mean there was some smoke in the building?
Mr. SKELTON - No; on the pavement - you know, pavement when it is hit with a hard object it will scatter - it will spread.
Mr. BALL - Which way did it spread?
Mr. SKELTON - It spread just right in line, like you said.
Mr. BALL - I haven't said anything - tell me what you think it was.
Mr. SKELTON - Like I said - south of us - it would be southwest, you know, in a direct line from the Texas Depository.
Mr. BALL - I see. In other words, the spray seemed to go to the west; is that right?
Mr. SKELTON - Yes.

Posner - Skelton's testimony is inconsistent with Posner's theory, both on the number of shots and the shot which hit the pavement.

Harris - Skelton's testimony is not specific enough to directly support Harris's theory, but it is consistent with it if you include the shot from the storm drain. Skelton does not mention that the fourth shot sounded like it came from a different location.

J.W. Foster's Warren Commission Testimony (back to the list of witnesses)

(Foster was standing on the triple overpass)

Mr. BALL - Now, tell me what you saw happen after the President's car passed - turned onto Elm from Houston.
Mr. FOSTER - After he came onto Elm I watched the men on the track more than I was him. Then I heard this loud noise, sound like a large firecracker. Kind of dumbfounded at first and then heard the second one. I moved to the banister of the overpass to see what was happening. Then the third explosion, and they were beginning to move around. I ran after I saw what was happening.
Mr. BALL - What did you see was happening?
Mr. FOSTER - Saw the president slump over in the car, and his head looked just like it blew up.
Mr. BALL - You saw that did you?
Mr. FOSTER - Yes, sir.
Mr. BALL - And what did you do then?
Mr. FOSTER - Well, at that time I broke and ran around to my right - to the left - around to the bookstore.
Mr. BALL - Now, did you have any opinion at that time as to the source of the sounds, the direction of the sounds?
Mr. FOSTER - Yes, sir.
Mr. BALL - What?
Mr. FOSTER - It came from back in toward the corner of Elm and Houston Streets.
Mr. BALL - That was you impression at that time?
Mr. FOSTER - Yes, sir.
Mr. BALL - Was any shot fired from the overpass?
Mr. FOSTER - No, sir.
Mr. BALL - Did you see anyone with a weapon there?
Mr. FOSTER - No, sir.
Mr. BALL - Or did you here any sound that appeared to come from the overpass?
Mr. FOSTER - No, sir.

(later testimony)

Mr. FOSTER - I moved to -down the roadway there, down to see if I could find where any of he shots hit.
Mr. BALL - Find anything?
Mr. FOSTER - Yes, sir. Found where one shot had hit the turf there at the location.
Mr. BALL - Hit the turf?
Mr. FOSTER - Yes, sir.
Mr. BALL - Did you see any marks on the street in anyplace?
Mr. FOSTER - No, a manhole cover. It was hit. they caught the manhole cover right on the corner and -
Mr. BALL - You saw a mark on the manhole cover did you?
Mr. FOSTER - Yes sir.
Mr. BALL - I show you a picture here of a concrete slab. or manhole cover. Do you recognize that picture?
Mr. FOSTER - Yes, sir.
Mr. BALL - Does the picture show - tell me what it shows there.
Mr. FOSTER - This looks like the corner here where it penetrated the turf right here [indicating].
Mr. BALL - See any mark on the manhole cover?
Mr. FOSTER - No, sir; I don't. not on the - well, it is on the turf, on the concrete, right in the corner.
Mr. BALL - Can you put an arrow showing the approximate place you saw that?
Mr. FOSTER - Should have been approximately along here[indicating].
Mr. BALL - Make it deep enough to mark. The arrow marks the position that you believe you saw the mark on the pavement?
Mr. FOSTER - Yes, sir.
Mr. BALL - It was not on the manhole cover?
Mr. FOSTER - No, sir.
Mr. BALL - Went into the turf?
Mr. FOSTER - Yes, sir.
Mr. BALL - Did you recover any bullet?
Mr. FOSTER - No, sir. It ricocheted on out.

Posner & Harris - Foster's testimony lacks enough detail to support or contradict either theory.

Frank Reilly's Warren Commission Testimony (back to the list of witnesses)

(Reilly was standing on the triple overpass)

Mr. Ball - Did you see the President's car?
Mr. REILLY - Yes
Mr. BALL - Where did you first see it.
Mr. REILLY - When it turned off of Houston Street and started around.
Mr. BALL - Onto Elm Street.
Mr. REILLY - Yes.
Mr. BALL - Is that the first time that you saw the President's car, when it turned off Houston Street to Elm Street?
Mr. REILLY - Yes.
Mr. BALL - How many people were there on the overpass at the time - at that time?
Mr. REILLY - Just what I told you.
Mr. BALL - Tell me again.
Mr. REILLY - Well there was Holland and me and Dick Dodd and those two fellows out there and the two policemen - that's all I remember seeing out there.
Mr. BALL - Did you hear something?
Mr. REILLY - Yes.
Mr. BALL - What did you hear?
Mr. REILLY - Three shots.
Mr. BALL - Where did they seem to come from; what direction?
Mr. REILLY - It seemed to me like they came from out of the trees.
Mr. BALL - What trees?
Mr. REILLY - On the north side of Elm Street at the corner up there.
Mr. BALL - On the north side of Elm - on what corner?
Mr. REILLY - Well, where all those trees are - you've never been down there?
Mr. BALL - Yes, I've been there, but you tell me - I want you to tell me because it has to go on the record here and it has to be in writing.
Mr. REILLY - Well, it's at the park where all the shrubs is up there - it's to the north of Elm Street - up the slope.

Posner & Harris - Reilly's testimony lacks enough detail to support either theory, and all three shots coming from the grassy knoll area is inconsistent with both theories

Earl Brown's Warren Commission Testimony (back to the list of witnesses)

(Brown was on the railway overpass that runs east and west over Stemmons Freeway)

Mr. BALL - Did you see the president's motorcade come on to Houston Street from Elm; were you able to see that?
Mr. BROWN - Now they came down Main, didn't they, to Houston
Mr. BALL - Yes.
Mr. BROWN - No, sir; actually, the first I noticed the car was when it stopped.
Mr. BALL - Where?
Mr. BROWN - After it made the turn and when the shots were fired, it stopped.
Mr. BALL - Did it come to a complete stop?
Mr. BROWN - That I couldn't swear too.
Mr. BALL - It appeared to be slowed down some?
Mr. BROWN - Yes; slowed down.
Mr. BALL - Did you hear shots?
Mr. BROWN - Yes, sir.
Mr. BALL - How many?
Mr. BROWN - Three.
Mr. BALL - Where did they come from?
Mr. BROWN - Well they seemed high to me, actually; if you want, would you like me to tell you?
Mr. BALL - Sure, tell it in your own words.
Mr. BROWN - Well, down in that river bottom there, there's a whole lot of pigeons this particular day, and they heard the shots before we did because I saw them flying up - must have been 50, 75 of them.
Mr. BALL - Where was the river bottom?
Mr. BROWN - You know, actually off to the - between us and the, this overpass you are talking about there's kind of a levee along there. It's really a grade of the railroad, is what it is; that's where they were and then I heard these shots and then I smelled this gun powder.
Mr. BALL - You did?
Mr. BROWN - It come on it would be maybe a couple minutes later so - at least it smelled like it to me.
Mr. BALL - What direction did the sound seem to come from?
Mr. BROWN - It came it seemed the direction of that building, that Texas -
Mr. BALL - School Book Depository?
Mr. BROWN - School Book Depository.
Mr. BALL - Did you see any pigeons flying around the building
Mr. BROWN - I don't recall that; no sir.
Mr. BALL - Which way did you look when you heard the sound?
Mr. BROWN - When I first heard that sound I looked up toward that building because actually it seemed to come from there.
Mr. BALL - Where was it you saw the pigeons rise?
Mr. BROWN - They must have been down there feeding at the time, because they just seemed to all take off.
Mr. BALL - Where were they from where you were standing?
Mr. BROWN - From where I was standing they would be about half way between - no, they would be more up toward that the overpass, what they call the triple underpass.
Mr. BALL - The triple underpass?
Mr. BROWN - Yes.
Mr. BALL - You were about 100 yards from the triple underpass?
Mr. BROWN - Approximately; yes.
Mr. BALL - Was there anybody standing on the triple underpass?
Mr. BROWN - On the triple underpass?
Mr. BALL - Yes.
Mr. BROWN - Yes, sir; they had at least two officers.
Mr. BALL - Anybody but police officers?
Mr. BROWN - Not that I know of. I don't recall anyone.
Mr. BALL - What did you do after the shots?
Mr. BROWN - Well, let me see, by that time the escort and motorcycles, we could see them coming, the front part of the motorcade, I don't think they probably realized what happened; they had come on ahead. And then we say the car coming with the President, and as it passed underneath me I looked right down and I could see this officer in the back; he had this gun and he was swinging it around, looked like a machinegun, and the President was all sprawled out, his foot on the back of the cushion. Of course, you couldn't conceive what happened, but we couldn't conceive the fact it did.

Posner & Harris - Brown's testimony lacks enough detail to support or contradict either theory.

James Romack's Warren Commission Testimony (back to the list of witnesses)

(Romack was Near Houston St. approximately 125 yards north of the Depository)

Mr. BELIN - All right, and what happened as you were walking?
Mr. ROMACK - I heard these three rifle shots sound out.
Mr. BELIN - Did you know they were rifle shots?
Mr. ROMACK - Yes, sir; I go elk hunting in Colorado every year in October, and I just came back from this trip, and I am pretty familiar with a rifle shot.
Mr. BELIN - How many did you here?
Mr. ROMACK - Three.
Mr. BELIN - Where did they sound like they came from?
Mr. ROMACK - It sounded, I guess, like it came from that building, but it wasn't on my side of the building.
Mr. BELIN - Did it sound like it was up high or low?
Mr. ROMACK - I would say they were high, I have never been asked that question, but it did sound like they were running out high, I would say, and the wind was blowing a little bit from the south that day, I can remember.
Mr. BELIN - The wind was blowing into your face as you walked, or was it blowing from your back, sir?
Mr. ROMACK - It was blowing into my face.
Mr. BELIN - Into your face. How far were you from the School Book Depository Building when you heard the shots?
Mr. ROMACK - Oh, I probably was 125 yards. 100 to 125 yards, would say.
Mr. BELIN - Would that be from the nearest corner of the building or from the front of Elm Street?
Mr. ROMACK - From the nearest corner of the building.
Mr. BELIN - From the northeast corner of the building?
Mr. ROMACK - Right.
Mr. BELIN - How close did the shots sound like they came together?
Mr. ROMACK - Oh, they happened pretty fast. I would say maybe 3 or 4 seconds apart.
Mr. BELIN - Were they equally spaced, or did one sound like it was closer than another one in time?
Mr. ROMACK - It sounded like to me that they were evenly spaced. They rang out pretty fast.
Mr. BELIN - Have you ever operated a bolt action rifle?
Mr. ROMACK - Yes, sir.
Mr. BELIN - Do you own one?
Mr. ROMACK - Yes, sir.
Mr. BELIN - Did it sound like the shots were faster than it could be operated with a bolt action rifle?
Mr. ROMACK - No sir.
(later testimony)
Mr. BELIN - If he were, say, from 40 to 75 yards away, or not an elk, a person, do you think you could shoot 40 to 75 yards away accurately as quickly as you heard those rifle sounds?
Mr. ROMACK - I wouldn't say I could; no sir.
Mr. BELIN - Do you think an accurate rifleman could?
Mr. ROMACK - Yes, sir.

Posner - Romack's testimony is consistent with Posner's theory.

Harris - Romack's testimony is inconsistent with Harris's timing and location of the shots.

Joe Murphy's Warren Commission Testimony (back to the list of witnesses)

(Murphy was on the Stemmons Freeway overpass)

Mr. BALL - Describe to me your best recollection as to what you heard?
Mr. MURPHY - Well, I heard - I knew they were shots as soon as I heard them, but I thought at first it was - it sounded like a shotgun, and then I got the the three shots and there were so many echoes and everything - then I did determine it sounded more like a rifle. I do quite a bit of hunting and I determined it sounded more like a rifle.
Mr. BALL - Those shots came from what direction?
Mr. MURPHY - Well, just from the direction I was looking - that's all I could tell. They came from an easterly direction, from where I was standing.
Mr. BALL - And were there echoes?
Mr. MURPHY - Yes, quite a few.

Posner & Harris - Murphy's testimony lacks enough detail to support or contradict either theory.

D. V. Harkness's Warren Commission Testimony (back to the list of witnesses)

(Harkness was on the west side of Main and Houston)

Mr. BELIN - Did you watch the motorcade come by?
Mr. HARKNESS - Yes, sir.
Mr. BELIN - Where were you when you heard the shots?
Mr. HARKNESS - I had started west on Main Street to the, I don't know what they call this area here.
Mr. BELIN - Plaza.
Mr. HARKNESS - On the Plaza area with the crowd to observe the President as he went west on Elm Street.
Mr. BELIN - How many shots did you hear?
Mr. HARKNESS - Three.
Mr. BELIN - What did you do after you heard those noises? Did you know they were shots, by the way?
Mr. HARKNESS - Yes, sir.
Mr. BELIN - What did you do?
Mr. HARKNESS - When I saw the first shot and the President's car slow down to almost a stop -
Mr. BELIN - When you saw the first shot, what do you mean by that?
Mr. HARKNESS - When I heard the first shot and saw the President's car almost come to a stop and some of the agents piling off the car, I went back to the intersection to get my motorcycle.
Mr. BELIN - You were in the process of doing that when you heard the second and third shots?
Mr. HARKNESS - Yes, sir.
Mr. BELIN - Where did the shots sound like they came from?
Mr. HARKNESS - I couldn't tell. They were bouncing off the buildings down there. I couldn't tell.
Mr. BELIN - You mean the reverberations?
Mr. HARKNESS - Yes.

Posner & Harris - Harkness's testimony lacks enough detail to support or contradict either theory.

Charles Douglas Givens's Warren Commission Testimony (back to the list of witnesses)

(Givens was on the corner of Main and Record)

Mr. BELIN - What did you do after you watched the motorcade?
Mr. GIVENS - We turned and started back down to the parking lot.
Mr. BELIN - Then what did you do?
Mr. GIVENS - Then we heard the shots, by the time we we got along in front of the Record Building, then we heard the shots.

(later testimony)

Mr. BELIN - How many shots did you here?
Mr. GIVENS - Three.

Posner & Harris - Givens's testimony lacks enough detail to support or contradict either theory.

Edward Shields's Warren Commission Testimony (back to the list of witnesses)

(Shields was on the corner of Main and Record)

Mr. BALL - Did you see the president's motorcade?
Mr. SHIELDS - I sure did.
Mr. BALL - Where was it when you saw it?
Mr. SHIELDS - I was just standing right around there at Mullendorf's Cafe.
Mr. BALL - At what address?
Mr. SHIELDS - On Record and Main.
Mr. BALL - Who was with you?
Mr. SHIELDS - Givens.
Mr. BALL - And did you here any shots?
Mr. SHIELDS - Yes; I heard the shots.
Mr. BALL - And what did you and Givens do after you heard the shots?
Mr. SHIELDS - I said, "the President has been shot"; we walked back to the lot and where Tracey was. I heard one shot and then a pause and then this repetition - two shots right behind the other, and I thought it was backfire from a car and I said, "Someone shot the President."
Mr. BALL - You said, "Someone shot the President"?
Mr. SHIELDS - That's right, I did. I didn't know what had happened.

Posner & Harris - Shields's testimony supports Harris on the timing.

Danny G. Arce's Warren Commission Testimony (back to the list of witnesses)

(Arce was standing in front of the Depository)

Mr. BALL - Did you see the President go by?
Mr. ARCE - Yeah, I did. I seen him when he turned the corner and when he went down that underpass thing and I heard them shots and I couldn't see anything. There was a lot of people.
Mr. BALL - Where were you standing when you heard the shots.
Mr. ARCE - I was standing in front of the Texas School Book Depository. I was on that grassy area part in front.
Mr. BALL - You were not on the sidewalk?
Mr. ARCE - No, I was on the sidewalk, then I walked up to the grass to get a higher view and still couldn't see.
Mr. BALL - Did you hear shots?
Mr. ARCE - Yeah.
Mr. BALL - How many?
Mr. ARCE - Three.
Mr. BALL - Where did you make out the direction of the sound?
Mr. ARCE - Yeah, I thought they came from the railroad tracks to the west of the Texas School Book Depository.

(later testimony)

Mr. BALL - Now, it sounded to you that the shots came from what direction?
Mr. ARCE - From the tracks on the west deal.
Mr. BALL - How many shots did you hear?
Mr. ARCE - Three.
Mr. BALL - Did you look back at the building?
Mr. ARCE - No, I didn't think they came from there. I just looked directly to the railroad tracks and all the people started running up there and I just ran along with them.
Mr. BALL - Did you go up to the railroad tracks?
Mr. ARCE - Yeah.
Mr. BALL - Did you see anything up there?
Mr. ARCE - No, and they told us go back there and I went back inside the building.

Posner & Harris - Arce's testimony does not support either theory.

Joe Molina's Warren Commission Testimony (back to the list of witnesses)

(Molina was standing on the steps in front of the Depository)

Mr. BALL - You saw the president's car pass?
Mr. Molina - Yes.
Mr. Ball - Did you see anything after that?
Mr. Molina - Well, I heard the shots.
Mr. Ball - Where - what was the source of the sound?
Mr. Molina - Sort of like it reverberated, sort of kind of came from the west side; that was the first impression I got. Of course, the first shot was fired then there was an interval between the first and second longer than the second and third.
Mr. Ball - What did you do after that?
Mr. Molina - Well, I just stood there, everybody was running and I didn't know what to do actually, because what could I do. I was just shocked

Posner - Molina's timing and location is inconsistent with his theory.

Harris - Molina's timing is excellent for Harris's first three shots, but he does not support a fourth shot.

Eddie Piper's Warren Commission Testimony (back to the list of witnesses)

(Piper was on the first floor of the Depository)

Mr. BALL - And were you sitting there when you heard the shot?
Mr. PIPER - That's right.
Mr. BALL - Tell me what you heard? Mr. PIPER - I heard one shot, and then the next shot went off - the one that shot him and I got up and went on back, back where they make coffee at the end of the counter where I could see what happened and before I could get there, the third shot went off, and I seen the people all running and in a few minutes someone came in the building, and I looked up and it was the bossman and a policeman or someone.
Mr. BALL - You say you heard one shot - you heard two shots and you got up and then what happened, where did you go?
Mr. PIPER - I came out to the end of the counter where they make coffee there by the stand.
Mr. BALL - You said you did it so you could see out better?
Mr. PIPER - No, sir; I did it to see what time it was - when all this happened - to see what time it was.
Mr. BALL - What time was it?
Mr. PIPER - It was about between 12:30 - between 12:27 and 12:30 - something like that, as near as I can remember.
Mr. BALL - Could you tell where the shots were coming from?
Mr. PIPER - No, sir - I couldn't, not for sure.
Mr. BALL - The direction?
Mr. PIPER - No, sir; I couldn't
Mr. BALL - Did you look out the window later?
Mr. PIPER - No more - no, sir; I didn't go back to any window.

(Later testimony)

Mr. BALL - Did you go to the Sheriff's department?
Mr. PIPER - I went to the county - yes, sir.
Mr. BALL - And did you tell them that you saw Lee about 12 o'clock?
Mr. PIPER - Yes. Mr. BALL - And that Lee said, "I'm going up to eat?"
Mr. PIPER - He said either "up" or "out" - that's the way I reported it.
Mr. BALL - That's what you told them?
Mr. PIPER - Yes, sir.
Mr. BALL - Now, on that day, did you tell them that the shots you heard seemed to come from inside the building?
Mr. PIPER - Yes, sir.
Mr. BALL - You did tell them that?
Mr. PIPER - Yes, sir.
Mr. BALL - Was that your best impression then?
Mr. PIPER - Yes; they seemed like they did come from the building, you know, by the vibration of that window - it seemed like nobody had shot in the window from the outside - it might have been coming from the building - is what I figured.
Mr. BALL - You told them that day that you thought it came from inside the building?
Mr. PIPER - Yes.
Mr. BALL - From inside the building?
Mr. PIPER - Yes.

Posner - Piper's testimony is consistent with Posner's theory.

Harris - Piper's testimony concerning the timing is not specific enough to rule out Harris's theory, but the fact that three shots were fired from within the depository are inconsistent with his theory.

Geneva Hine's Warren Commission Testimony (back to the list of witnesses)

(Hine was on the first floor of the Depository)

Mr. BALL - What did you see?
Miss HINE - I saw the escort car come first up the middle of Houston Street.
Mr. BALL - Going north on Houston Street?
Miss HINE - Yes, sir; going north on Houston Street. I saw it turn left and I saw the President's car coming and I saw the President and saw him waving his hand in greeting up in the air and I saw his wife and I saw him turn the corner and after he turned the corner I looked and I saw the next car coming just at that instant I saw the next car coming up was when I heard the shots.
Mr. BALL - How many did you hear?
Miss HINE - Three.
Mr. BALL - Could you tell where the shots were coming from?
Miss HINE - Yes, sir; they came from inside the building.
Mr. BALL - How do you know that?
Miss HINE - Because the building vibrated from the result of the explosion coming in.
Mr. BALL - It appeared to you that the shots came from the building?
Miss HINE - Yes, sir.
Mr. BALL - Did you know they were shots at the time?
Miss HINE - Yes, sir; they sounded almost like cannon shots they were so terrific.
Mr. BALL - That is when you were at the window, is that right?
Miss HINE - Yes, sir; that is when I was at the window, because the next car, you see, was coming up and turning and I looked. Of course I looked when I heard the shots. I just stood there and saw people running; I saw people falling down, you know, lying on the sidewalk.
Mr. BALL - That was on Houston Street?
Miss HINE - No, sir; Elm.
Mr. BALL - You could see - could you see any part of Elm?
Miss HINE - East, yes sir.

Posner - Hine's testimony is consistent with Posner's theory.

Harris - Hine's testimony concerning the timing is not specific enough to rule out Harris's theory, but the fact that three shots were fired from within the depository are inconsistent with his theory.

Doris Burns's Warren Commission Testimony (back to the list of witnesses)

(Burns was on the third floor of the Depository)

Miss BURNS - ...As I went down this hall towards the windows that looked out on Houston Street, I heard a shot, but I didn't think much about it. I didn't of course, know it was a shot because when you here tire backfire and all, they all sound alike to me, so I didn't think a thing about that.
I went around to Allyn and Bacon, and Mr. Wilson, the manager, was at the window looking out. He was the only one in there, so I asked him if I could look out the window with him. About that time he said, "oh, my god, there's been a shooting." I still didn't think anybody, of course, had been killed, just that somebody had shot in the air or something, so I said "Has the President already passed?" And he said "yes", so I looked out and that big bus, was passing. So I said "Well, I guess I have missed the President then," and I started on back out of the office and I just said as I left. "Well, I hope nobody got hurt."
Mr. BALL - You heard how many shots?
Miss BURNS - Just one.
Mr. BALL - Just one?
Miss BURNS - It must have been the last one because I didn't hear any more.
Mr. BALL - Did you have any idea where it was coming from?
Miss BURNS - Well, it sounded as though it was back of me. You see, I was going towards Houston Street. I was facing east and it sounded to me as if it came toward my back.

Posner & Harris - Burns's testimony lacks enough detail to support or contradict either theory.

Hugh William Betzner's Affidavit (back to the list of witnesses)

I was standing on Houston Street near the intersection of Elm Street. I took a picture of President Kennedy's car as it passed along Houston Street. I have an old camera. I looked down real quick and rolled the film to take the next picture. I then ran down to the corner of Elm andHouston Streets, this being the southwest corner. I was standing back from the corner and had to take the pictures through some of the crowd. I ran on down Elm a little more and President Kennedy's car was starting to go down the hill to the triple underpass. I was running trying to keep the President's car in my view and was winding my film as I ran. I was looking down at my camera to see the number of the film as I ran. I took another picture as the President's car was going down the hill on Elm Street. I started to wind my film again and I heard a loud noise. I thought that this noise was either a firecracker or a car had backfired. I looked up and it seemed like there was another loud noise in the matter of a few seconds. I looked down the street and I could see the President's car and another one and they looked like the cars were stopped. Then I saw a flash of pink like someone standing up and then sitting back down in the car. Then I ran around so I could look over the back of a monument and I either saw the following then or when I was sitting back down on the corner of Elm Street. I cannot remember exactly where I was when I saw the following:

I heard at least two shots fired and I saw what looked like a firecracker going off in the president's car. My assumption for this was because I saw fragments going up in the air.

Posner & Harris - Betzner's Affidavit lacks enough detail to support or contradict either theory.

Mary Moorman's Affidavit (back to the list of witnesses)

Mrs. Jean Hill and I were standing on the grass by the park on Elm Street between the underpass and the corner of Elm & Houston. I had a Polaroid Camera with me and was intending to take pictures of President Kennedy and the motorcade. As the motorcade started toward me I took two pictures. As President Kennedy was opposite me I took a picture of him. As I snapped the picture of President Kennedy, I heard a shot ring out. President Kennedy kind of slumped over. Then I heard another shot ring out and Mrs. Kennedy jumped up in the car and said, "My God he had been shot." When I heard these shots ring out, I fell to the ground to keep from being hit myself. I heard three or four shots in all. After the pictures I took were developed, the Picture of President Kennedy showed him slumped over. When the pictures were developed, they came out real light. These pictures have been turned over to Officers investigating this incident.

Posner & Harris - Moorman's Affidavit lacks enough detail to support or contradict either theory.

Gayle Newman's Affidavit (back to the list of witnesses)

My husband Billy, myself and our children were standing about halfway between the corner of Elm and Houston and the underpass. We were the last people in line going toward the underpass. When President Kennedy's car was about ten feet from us. I heard a noise like a firecracker going off. President Kennedy kind of jumped like he was startled and covered his head with his hands and then raised up. After I heard the first shot, another shot sounded and Governor Connally kind of grabbed his chest and lay back on the seat of the car. When I first saw and heard all of this, I thought it was all of a joke. Just about the time President Kennedy was right in front of us, I heard another shot ring out, and the President put his hands up to his head. I saw blood all over the side of his head. About this time Mrs. Kennedy grabbed the President and he kind of lay over to the side kind of in her arms. Then my husband, Billy, said it is a shot. We grabbed our two children and my husband lay on one child and I lay on the other one in the grass. We started to get up and then all of a sudden we lay back down, [sic] I don't know what it was but another shot may have been fired that caused us to lay back down.

Posner & Harris - Gail Newman's Affidavit lacks enough detail to support or contradict either theory.

William Eugene Newman's Affidavit (back to the list of witnesses)

Today at about 12:45 pm I was standing in a group of people on Elm Street near the west end of the concrete standard when the President's car turned left off Houston Street onto Elm Street. We were standing at the edge of the curb looking at the car as it was coming toward us and all of a sudden there was a noise, apparently gunshot. The President jumped up in his seat, and it looked like what I thought was a firecracker had went off and I thought he had realized it. It was just like an explosion and he was standing up. By this time he was directly in front of us and I was looking directly at him when he was hit in the side of the head. Then he fell back and Governor Connally was holding his middle section. Then we fell down on the grass as it seemed we were in direct path of fire. It looked like Mrs. Kennedy jumped on top of the President. He kinda fell back and it looked like she was holding him. Then the car sped away and everybody in that area had run upon top of that little mound. I thought the shot had come from the garden directly behind me, that it was on an elevation from where I was as I was right on the curb. I do not recall looking toward the Texas School Book Depository. I looked back in the vacinity of the garden.

Posner & Harris - William E. Newman's Affidavit lacks enough detail to support or contradict either theory.

Jean Newman's Affidavit (back to the list of witnesses)

I was standing right on this side of the Stemmons Freeway sign, about half-way between the sign and the edge of the building on the corner. I was by myself, there were other people around watching the motorcade. The motorcade had just passed me when I heard that I thought was a firecracker at first, and the President had just passed me, because after he had just passed, there was a loud report, it just scared me, and I noticed that the President jumped, he sort of ducked his head down and I thought at the time that it probably scared him, too, just like it did me, because he flinched, like he jumped. I saw him put his elbows like this, with his hands on his chest.
By this time, the motorcade never did stop, and the President fell to his left and his wife jumped up on her knees, I believe it was, in the back of the car on her knees, I couldn't say that for sure. And I realized then it had been a shot. I looked in the car and she was on her knees, and he wasn't even visible in the car. I looked around then, and everyone was running every which way, I don't know why I didn't run, I just stood there and backed up and looked around to see if I could see anything, but I saw no one whatever with anything that resembled a gun or anything of that kind.
I just heard two shots. When it happened, I was just looking at the President and his wife, and when she jumped up in the car, I had my vision focused on her, and I didn't see anything else, about the others in the front of the car.
The first impression I had was that the shots came from my right.

Posner & Harris - Jean Newman's Affidavit lacks enough detail to support or contradict either theory.

Charles Hester's Affidavit (back to the list of witnesses)

My wife, Beatrice and I were sitting on the grass on the slope on Elm Street where the park is located. When President Kennedy's car got almost down to the underpass, I heard two shots ring out. Thye sounded like they came from immediately behind us and over our heads. We did [not?] see the shooting. I immediately turned and looked at the Texas Book Depository building and did not see anyone. The shots sounded like the definitely came from in or around the building. I grabbed my wife because I didn't know where the next shot was coming from and dragged her up next to the concrete imbankment and threw her down on the ground and got on the ground with her. Then there was utter confusion. The Police rushed toward the railroad tracks and I finally found an officer to go to the Texas Book Depository Building. The officer I contacted was Officer Wiseman of the Dallas Sheriff's Department.

Posner & Harris - Hester's Affidavit lacks enough detail to support or contradict either theory.

John Arthur Chism's Affidavit (back to the list of witnesses)

I am married and have three children. I was standing with my wife and three year old boy, we were directly in front of the Stemmons Freeway sign, as the motorcade rounded the corner from Houston onto Elm.
When I saw the motorcade round the corner, the President was standing and waving to the crowd. And just as he got just about in front of me, he turned and waved at the crowd on this side of the street, the right side; at this point I heard what sounded like one shot, and I saw him, "The President," sit back in his seat and lean his head to his left side. At this point, I saw Mrs. Kennedy stand up and pull his head over in her lap, and then lay down over him as if to shield him.
And the two men in the front seat, I don't know who they were, looked back, and just about the time they looked back, the second shot was fired.At this point, I looked behind me, to see whether it was a fireworks display or something. And then I saw a lot of people funning for cover, behind the embankment there back up on the grass.

Posner & Harris - John Chism's Affidavit lacks enough detail to support or contradict either theory.

Marvin Faye Chism's Affidavit (back to the list of witnesses)

I was with my husband and three year old child, we were standing at the corner where the sign says "Stemmons Freeway" to the right. As the President was coming through, I heard this first shot, and the President fell to his left. The President's wife immediately stood over him, and she pulled him up, and lay him down in the seat, and she stood up over him in the car. The President was standing and waving and smiling at the people when the shot happened.
And then there was a second shot that I heard, after the President's wife had pulled him down in the seat. It came from what I thought was behind us and I looked but I couldn't see anything.
The two men in the front of the car stood up, and then when the second shot was fired, they all fell down and the car took off just like that. After the motorcade went by, after that, I jumped up and headed for my car, we were parked up on the freeway. A police patrolman came up where we were, and we told him what we saw.

Posner & Harris - Marvin Faye Chism's Affidavit lacks enough detail to support or contradict either theory.

J.C. Price's Affidavit (back to the list of witnesses)

This day at about 12:35 PM I was on the roof of the Terminal Annex Bldg on the NE corner when the presidential motorcade came down Main to Houston, North on Houston and then West on Elm. The cars had proceeded west on Elm and was just a short distance from the Tripple underpass, when I saw Gov. Connelly slump over. I did not see the president as his car had gotten out of my view under the underpass. There was a volley of shots, and then much later, maybe as much as five minutes later, another one. I saw one man run towards the passenger cars on the railroad siding after the volley of shots. This man had a white dress shirt, no tie and kahki colored trousers. His hair appeared to be long and dark and his agility running could be about 35 yrs of age. He had something in his hand. I couldn't be sure but it may have been a head piece. XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

Posner & Harris - Price's Affidavit lacks enough detail to support or contradict either theory.

Garland Slack's Affidavit (back to the list of witnesses)

Today, I was standing on Houston Street, just below the window to Sheriff Decker's office waiting for the parade. I was standing there when the President's car passed and just after they rounded the corner from Houston onto Elm Street, I heard a report and I knew at once it was a high-powered rifle shot. I am a [cross-out] big game hunter and am familiar with the sound of hi powered rifles and I knew when I heard the retort that the shot had hit something. Within a [cross-out] few seconds I heard another retort and knew it also had hit something and all I could see was the highly colored hat that Mrs. Kennedy had on. I couldn't see anything else. I was so sick that I went back to my office but after thinking it over, I came back as a citizen to offer my statement if it could help in any way. During the time I was standing there I did look up into the building where the Texas Book Depository is and saw some people, maybe 12 or 14, hanging out of windows, but I didn't see anyone with a gun.
When the sound of this shot came, it sounded to me like this shot came from away back or from within a building. I have heard this same sort of sound when a shot has come from within a cave, as I have been on many big game hunts.

Posner & Harris - Slack's Affidavit lacks enough detail to support or contradict either theory.

Malcolm Sumers's Affidavit (back to the list of witnesses)

Yesterday, November 23, 1963, I was standing on the terrace of the small park on Elm Street to watch the President's motorcade. The President's car had just come up in front of me when I heard a shot and saw the President slump down in the car and heard Mrs. Kennedy say, "Oh, no," then a second shot and then I hit the ground as I realized these were shots. Then all of the people started running up the terrace away from the President's car and I got up and started running also, not realizing what had happened. In just a few moments the President's car sped off and everyone was just running around towards the railroad tracks and I knew that they had somebody trapped up there. I imagine I stayed there 15 or 20 minutes and then went over on Houston Street to where I had my truck parked. I had just pulled away from the curb and was headed toward the Houston street viaduct when an automobile that had 3 men in it pulled away from the curb in a burst of speed, passing me on the right side, which was very dangerous at that point, then got in front of me, and it seemed then as an afterthought, slowed in a big hurry in front of me as though realizing they would be conspicuous in speeding. These three men were of slender build and seemed to be very excited in talking and motioning to each other. They went on across the Houston Street Viaduct and I turned off at Marsalis Street exit and they continued on going towards Zangs Blvd. They were in a 1961 or 1962 Chevrolet sedan, maroon in color. I [cross-out] don't believe I could identify these men, but I do believe I could identify the automobile if I saw it again.

Posner & Harris - Summers's Affidavit lacks enough detail to support or contradict either theory.

Some general comments (back to the list of witnesses)

Has this been an exercise in futility? I have to admit, these witnesses are often at odds with both men's theories. Does that prove that they are both wrong and the truth is yet to be revealed? Probably not. No matter what theory anyone gives this witness testimony will never completely support that theory. So what can be concluded after spending hours pouring over all of this testimony? If the only thing you have learned after reading all of this is, don't believe anybody who tells you that "all of the witnesses" support anything, then I will feel the work put into creating this site was worth while.

While some witnesses tend to support Posner and others tend to support Harris, there is almost no other corroborating evidence to support Harris. Several witnesses pinpoint the sixth floor of the depository as the exact location of the shots and some actually saw a man fitting Oswald's description firing the shots. As far as I know, no witness specifically mentions the Dal-Tex building or the sewer as the source of the shots, let alone seeing a shooter at these locations. If I am wrong about this, please let me know who that witness is, so I can include their story as soon as possible.

Frankly the idea of having alternative shooters on the second floor of the Dal-Tex building, and in a storm sewer don't make much sense. Harris admits that the second floor location does not give a good angle for a shot at the president. That is why he claims that shooter missed. Why not put that shooter on the roof, where he would have a better angle. The same is true of a person in the storm sewer. That person would have a very limited sight and a very narrow time span to shoot in. I am not sure what the dimensions are of the pipe that runs into that sewer, but unless it is extremely large, any shooter would have been trapped in there after the shooting, leaving them extremely exposed to arrest, if they were detected.

While some people think the term "lone nut" somehow discredits the Oswald acting alone scenario, to this day it is the only scenario that a large group of dedicated researchers agree on. The conspiracy researches seem to agree on only one point. Oswald didn't do it alone. From there on, I have found few points that they agree on. The conspiracy people always use the fact that the general public thinks there was a conspiracy as some sort of evidence supporting their claims. With all of the contradictions in the testimony it does not surprise me that people think "something else must have happened" The questions the conspiracy researchers have never been able to answer specifically is, what else could have happened?

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